What
most Latter-day Saints have been taught in church and believe as truth.
Significant details & problems that most Latter-day
Saints are not aware of.
Witnesses to other amazing events.
Testimony of Abagail and Lucy Harris.
Responses
to these issues by faithful Latter-day Saints.
What
most Latter-day Saints have been taught in church and believe as truth.
In every copy of the Book of Mormon is the signed statement by the witnesses of the BOM. The three special witnesses saw the Angel Moroni and the plates. The eight other witnesses just saw and handled the golden plates.
The 11 witnesses were all good, honorable men and regarded as upstanding members of the community.
The three special witnesses all saw the Angel and the plates together as a group. The eight witnesses also saw the plates as a group.
Most members are aware that many of the witnesses, including all three of the special witnesses, apostatized and left the church. Oliver Cowdery and perhaps Martin Harris rejoined the church shortly before they died.
Although many of the witnesses left the church, none of them ever denied their testimony regarding seeing the plates.
The witnesses’ testimonies are regarded as literally being true. They all did in fact see and touch the plates with their own eyes and hands.
The title page of the Book of Mormon
reads:
The Testimony Of Three Witnesses
BE IT KNOWN unto all nations, kindreds, tongues, and people,
unto whom this work shall come: That we, through the grace of God the Father,
and our Lord Jesus Christ, have seen the plates which contain this record,
which is a record of the people of Nephi, and also of the Lamanites, their
brethren, and also of the people of Jared, who came from the tower of which
hath been spoken. And we also know that they have been translated by the gift
and power of God, for his voice hath declared it unto us; wherefore we know of
a surety that the work is true. And we also testify that we have seen the
engravings which are upon the plates; and they have been shown unto us by the
power of God, and not of man. And we declare with words of soberness, that an
angel of God came down from heaven, and he brought and laid before our eyes,
that we beheld and saw the plates, and the engravings thereon; and we know that
it is by the grace of God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, that we beheld
and bear record that these things are true. And it is marvelous in our eyes.
Nevertheless, the voice of the Lord commanded us that we should bear record of
it; wherefore, to be obedient unto the commandments of God, we bear testimony
of these things. And we know that if we are faithful in Christ, we shall rid
our garments of the blood of all men, and be found spotless before the
judgment-seat of Christ, and shall dwell with him eternally in the heavens..
And the honor be to the Father, & to the Son, & to the Holy Ghost,
which is One God. Amen.'
Oliver
Cowdery
David Whitmer
Martin Harris
BE IT KNOWN unto all nations, kindreds, tongues, and people,
unto whom this work shall come: That Joseph Smith, Jun., the translator of this
work, has shown unto us the plates of which hath been spoken, which have the
appearance of gold ; and as many of the leaves as the said Smith has translated
we did handle with our hands; and we also saw the engravings thereon, all of
which has the appearance of ancient work, and of curious workmanship. And this
we bear record with words of soberness, that the said Smith has shown unto us,
for we have seen and hefted, and know of a surety that the said Smith has got
the plates of which we have spoken. And we give our names unto the world, to
witness unto the world that which we have seen. And we lie not, God bearing
witness of it.
Christian
Whitmer Joseph Smith, Sr.
Jacob Whitmer Hyrum Smith
Peter Whitmer Hiram Page
John Whitmer Samuel H. Smith
Significant details
& problems that most Latter-day Saints are not aware of.
The following two essays provide a very good analysis of the arguments against the witnesses by critics. Note: these essays are very similar with many common elements. Please do not skip reading the following essays as the information presented below is for the most part, in addition to what’s presented in those two essays.
http://www.irr.org/mit/bom-wit-pt1.html
http://www.exmormon.org/file9.htm
Here are a few key points from the essays listed above.
1) The witnesses’ experiences may have only been visionary in nature. There are many statements given by the witnesses that indicate they only saw the angel and the plates in a visionary experience. Why would people need to see real, physical plates in a vision or a real angel that was physically on the earth? There are also several statements saying that the only time they saw the plates was when the plates were covered in a cloth or tow frock.
2) The witnesses did not all see the plates or angel at the same time. The plates were seen in two groups of four not all eight together as popularized in church paintings. Only David Whitmer and perhaps Oliver Cowdery saw the angel together. Martin Harris removed himself from the group and did not see the angel until perhaps three days later. Why is this significant? Any magician will tell you that it is easier to deceive people in smaller groups.
3) David Whitmer said “If you believe my testimony to the Book of Mormon; if you believe that God spake to us three witnesses by his own voice, then I tell you that in June, 1838, God spake to me again by his own voice from the heavens, and told me to separate myself from among the Latter-day Saints, for as they sought to do unto me, so should it be done unto them.” So which statement was David Whitmer lying about or had been mistaken about? Either way he doesn’t sound like a completely trustworthy witness.
4) All the witnesses had close ties to Joseph and his family. Some like Martin Harris had a substantial financial investment in the success of the Book of Mormon.
5) These men lived in the early 1800s and believed in magical things like many people did during that time period such as divining rods, second sight, seer stones, etc. Some of the witnesses, especially Martin Harris, were easily swayed by tales of the supernatural, especially in a religious context.
6) Many
of the witnesses ended up leaving the church and following other leaders and
religions such as Jesse Strang, the Shakers, Methodists, etc. By 1847 not a single one of the surviving
eleven witnesses was part of the
7) Of the witnesses that left the church, most believed that Joseph was at best a fallen prophet, the church changed its doctrines in error and changed revelations against God’s will.
8) The witness, who have been heralded as good, honest, Abe Lincoln-type of men were later called liars, counterfeiters, thieves, etc. by Joseph Smith himself.
Witnesses
to other amazing events
Many people that whole-heartedly believe the Book of Mormon witnesses do so because they have a hard time thinking that these people would either lie or could have been deceived. That’s fair enough. But why then should we not believe the witnesses to the following stories:
SOLOMON SPAULDING WITNESSES
There are seven witnesses that say Solomon Spalding was the author of the Book of Mormon. Seven people wrote affidavits testifying that they had read early drafts of the Book of Mormon by author Solomon Spalding. In some ways they are more credible as they each wrote their own account instead of merely signing a prepared statement.
Here’s the testimony of the first of these seven witnesses, the brother of Solomon Spalding:
He [Solomon] then told me
had he been writing a book, which he intended to have printed, the avails of
which he thought would enable him to pay all his debts. The book was entitled
the “Manuscript Found,” of which he read to me many passages. -- It was an
historical romance of the first settlers of
JOHN SPALDING.”
To read the rest of the witnesses claiming Solomon Spalding wrote the book that was modified into the Book of Mormon:
http://www.mormonstudies.com/witness.htm
Obviously both sets of witnesses cannot be correct. At least one set, possibly both sets, of witnesses were either lying or were mistaken or deceived. Which group is to be believed or are they both in error?
We’re not saying we believe the Spalding witnesses over the Book of Mormon witnesses, but it proves the point that just because a group of people claims something extraordinary happened to them, it doesn’t make it so.
For more on the Spaulding theories:
http://mormonstudies.com/criddle/rigdon.htm
JESSE STRANG WITNESSES
LDS leader Jesse
Strang claimed to be the true prophet that succeeded Joseph after he was
killed. Many people followed Strang
after he sent a letter claiming he had received a revelation that he should be
prophet.
The letter
convinced most of Smith's family and several other prominent Mormons that Strang's
claims were genuine. John Whitmer, David Whitmer, Martin Harris, Hiram Page, John E. Page, William E. McLellin, William
Smith, Smith's first wife and widow, Emma
Hale Smith, the sisters of
Joseph Smith, William Marks, George
Miller, and others, including Joseph Smith's
mother, Lucy Mack Smith. Lucy wrote to Reuben
Hedlock: "I am satisfied that Joseph
appointed J.J. Strang. It is verily so."(ibid) According to William Smith,
all of Joseph Smith's family (excepting Hyrum Smith's widow), endorsed Strang; (Palmer, 211)
Here we have all of the living Book of Mormon witnesses,
except Oliver Cowdery, as well as most of Smith’s family and several other
prominent members of the early LDS church accept Strang’s claim of being a
prophet by merely reading his letter.
How much credibility can we give these people when they accept someone
so easily as a prophet who later turns out to be a fraud?
In all, about
12,000 Latter-day saints recognized Strang's claims. A smaller group followed him to Beaver Island in Lake Michigan.
Most of his initial
followers, including those listed above, would leave Strang's church before his
death. Some eventually followed Brigham Young,
but Smith's immediate family never did, and many of them formed the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints
a few years later.
There are many
witnesses to Jesse Strang’s claim of having unearthed metal plates which he
translated into scripture. Strang's
translation of the metal plates was transcribed by Samuel Graham, and published
as Book of the Law of the Lord, said to be
the original law as it was given to Moses.
The following is
from the first page of the Book of the Law of the Lord with the testimony of the witnesses to the plates
from which the book was translated from.
Does this sound familiar?
Be it known unto all nations, kindreds, tongues and people, to whom this Book of the Law of the Lord shall come, that James J. Strang has the plates of the ancient Book of the Law of the Lord given to Moses, from which he translated this law, and has shown them to us. We examined them with our eyes, and handled them with our hands. The engravings are beautiful antique workmanship, bearing a striking resemblance to the ancient oriental languages; and those from which the laws in this book were translated are eighteen in number, about seven inches and three-eights wide, by nine inches long, occasionally embellished with beautiful pictures.
And we testify unto you all that the everlasting
SAMUEL GRAHAM,
SAMUEL P. BACON,
PHINEAS WRIGHT,
ALBERT N. HOSMER,
EBENEZER PAGE,
JEHIEL SAVAGE.
http://www.strangite.org/Law.htm
Here’s the detailed accounts of several witnesses that seem very similar to the BOM witnesses:
Testimony of Witnesses to the Voree Plates.
1. On the thirteenth day of
September, 1845, we, Aaron Smith, Jirah B. Wheelan, James M. Van Nostrand, and
Edward Whitcomb, assembled at the call of James J. Strang, who is by us and
many others approved as a Prophet and Seer of God. He proceeded to inform us that
it had been revealed to him in a vision that an account of an ancient people
was buried in a hill south of White River bridge, near the east line of
Walworth County; and leading us to an oak tree about one foot in diameter, told
us that we would find it enclosed in a case of rude earthen ware under that
tree at the depth of about three feet; requested us to dig it up, and charged
us to so examine the ground that we should know we were not imposed upon, and
that it had not been buried there since the tree grew. The tree was surrounded
by a sward of deeply rooted grass, such as is usually found in the openings,
and upon the most critical examination we could not discover any indication
that it had ever been cut through or disturbed.
2. We then dug up the tree, and
continued to dig to the depth of about three feet, where we found a case of
slightly baked clay containing three plates of brass. On one side of one is a
landscape view of the south end of
3. The case was found imbedded in
indurated clay so closely fitting it that it broke in taking out, and the earth
below the soil was so hard as to be dug with difficulty even with a pickax.
Over the case was found a flat stone about one foot wide each way and three
inches thick, which appeared to have undergone the action of fire, and fell in
pieces after a few minutes exposure to the air. The digging extended in the
clay about eighteen inches, there being two kinds of earth of different color
and appearance above it.
4. We examined as we dug all the
way with the utmost care, and we say, with utmost confidence, that no part of
the earth through which we dug exhibited any sign or indication that it had
been moved or disturbed at any time previous. The roots of the tree stuck down
on every side very closely, extending below the case, and closely interwoven
with roots from other trees. None of them had been broken or cut away. No clay
is found in the country like that of which the case is made.
5. In fine, we found an alphabetic
and pictorial record, carefully cased up, buried deep in the earth, covered
with a flat stone, with an oak tree one foot in diameter growing over it, with
every evidence that the sense can give that it has lain there as long as that
tree has been growing. Strang took no part in the digging, but kept entirely
away from before the first blow was struck till after the plates were taken out
of the case; and the sole inducement to our digging was our faith in his
statement as a Prophet of the Lord that a record would thus and there be found.
AARON SMITH,
JIRAH B. WHEELAN,
J. M. VAN NOSTRAND,
EDWARD WHITCOMB.
http://www.strangite.org/Reveal.htm
Strang actually had his plates in a museum for all to see for a time. If he was a fraud then it was obvious that he had made a prop of sufficient quality to fool a prolonged, detailed visual inspection by the public. This shows that making a prop of ancient plates during Joseph’s time wasn’t all that difficult. Also Joseph’s plates were never shown in public and were always covered and if they were ever actually shown to the witnesses, it was only very briefly.
Jesse also reportedly had someone coated with phosphorescent paint to appear to be an angel in order to have witnesses that really believed in him.
Note 3: For an
exemplary "amusing experiment" involving phosphorus, see Patriarch
William Smith's 1849 account
of how the Mormon leader James J. Strang made serruptitious use of the glowing
substance in a darkened room: "The phosphorus then gave a most brilliant
light upon the heads of the saints. The Holy Ghost was poured out in this way,
and the sign given that Strang was a prophet." Elder J. J. Moss, who
observed the advent of Mormonism at Kirtland, Ohio, provided his opinion
of how the luminous angels observed thereabouts (David Whitmer saw one at the
Temple) might have been similarly manufactured: "The Morley family would
invite strangers... to stay with them all night & every one that stayed
however strong their opposition before were baptized the next morning. Having
studied in my boyhood the Black Art Ledgerdemain & jugling I had my
suspicions aroused... & I told how Angels could be manufactured &
strange wonders made to appear in the night & from that time forth
invitations to stay over night ceased to be given & no more converts were
made in that way..." etc., etc.
http://www.sidneyrigdon.com/dbroadhu/NY/wayn1830.htm#061230 (click
on the link to "RF June 12 '30")
Strang’s plates have since been lost and he continues to have a following even today by those who believe his story the same as the faithful LDS believe Joseph’s story, when no plates exist today to be examined for both Joseph Smith and Jesse Strang.
References
http://www.strangite.org/Law.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Jesse_Strang
http://www.strangite.org/Plates.htm
http://mormoninquiry.typepad.com/mormon_inquiry/2006/05/the_man_who_wou.html
http://www.terrypepper.com/Lights/closeups/strang/strang.htm
http://www.strangite.org/Famous.htm
THE SHAKERS – ANNE LEE
The Shakers felt that "Christ has made his second appearance on earth, in a chosen female known by the name of Ann Lee, and acknowledged by us as our Blessed Mother in the work of redemption" (Sacred Roll and Book, p.358). The Shakers, of course, did not believe the Book of Mormon, but they had a book entitled A Holy, Sacred and Divine Roll and Book; From the Lord God of Heaven, to the Inhabitants of Earth. More than sixty individuals gave testimony to the Sacred Roll and Book, which was published in 1843. Although not all of them mention angels appearing, some of them tell of many angels visiting them—one woman told of eight different visions.
Martin Harris joined the Shakers for about two years. Here is the statement of members of the Shakers:
We, the undersigned, hereby testify, that we saw the holy Angel standing upon the house-top, as mentioned in the foregoing declaration, holding the Roll and Book.
|
Betsey Boothe. |
Sarah Maria Lewis. |
Joseph Smith only had three witnesses who claimed to see an angel. The Shakers, however, had a large number of witnesses who claimed they saw angels and the Roll and Book. There are over a hundred pages of testimony from "Living Witnesses." The evidence seems to show that Martin Harris accepted the Sacred Roll and Book as a divine revelation. Clark Braden stated: "Harris declared repeatedly that he had as much evidence for a Shaker book he had as for the Book of Mormon" (The Braden and Kelly Debate, p.173).
Why should we believe the Book of Mormon witnesses but not the Shakers witnesses? What are we to make of Martin Harris’s comment that he had as much evidence for the Shaker book he had as for the Book of Mormon?
http://christiandefense.org/LDS%20Three%20Witnesses.htm
VIRGIN MARY SIGHTINGS
The are countless stories of people, even groups of people, that claim to have see the Virgin Mary. These people are almost always Catholics and they take this as a sign that the Catholic Church is true and they are following God’s correct path. Obviously if all these people are really witnessing visions of the Virgin Mary, then how can the LDS church be true?
There is a well-known
vision of the Virgin Mary to three children at
ALIEN ABDUCTION CASE – TRAVIS WALTON
On November 5, 1975, seven men witnessed a spacecraft from
another world hovering silently between tall pines in the
There were seven witnesses to this event. They all passed lie-detector tests and none
of them have ever recounted their story.
This was even made into a movie called ‘Fire in the Sky’ with James
Garner playing the sheriff who investigated the story.
We don’t know if the story is really true or not but if it is
our country and even the world is in serious danger. Any human could be abducted by aliens at any
time and subjected to horrific medical tests as Travis Walton claimed was performed
on him by beings from another planet.
Yet if it was true, wouldn’t the governments and the people of the world
be more concerned about this? Or is it
that, despite the fact that we have seven honorable witnesses to the event and
no evidence of a fraud, we really don’t believe these witnesses? http://www.travis-walton.com/index.shtml
ANGEL APPEARING TO MUHAMMAD
The appearance of the angel Gabriel to Muhammad and his subsequent divine commission to bring forth new scripture that, today, is revered by approximately 2 billion Muslims the world over. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad#The_first_revelations
OTHERS
There are many, many reported witnesses to UFOs, Bigfoot, the Lochness Monster, Abominable Snowman, alien abductions, etc. There are literally hundreds of thousands of witnesses to these amazing phenomena. Should they be believed as well?
The famous Lochness Monster photo taken in 1934 by a surgeon was believed to be genuine by many people due to the credibility of the witness. It wasn’t until March 1994 that it was revealed that the "surgeon's picture" was a practical joke after all by his son, Ian.
The famous 1967 Bigfoot video referred to as the Patterson video was believed by many people to be genuine as well. One of the main reasons was the credibility of one of the witnesses. He seemed very sincere in his statements and had a very good upstanding reputation as an honest man.
It wasn’t until many years later that he started to believe that he was tricked. He now thinks he was carefully led down a ravine where someone had been waiting in an ape suit to purposely trick him. The best witness of course is someone that really believes he saw the event. The Book of Mormon witnesses may have been deceived as well and were not lying as far as they were concerned.
Many fantastic stories that have had numerous witnesses have been proved to be hoaxes yet many people still hold steadfast to their unbelievable claims. It just proves that there are many, many people that have said, and will say, they are witnesses to very improbable events. Many of these phenomena are in opposition to LDS church’s beliefs, so all of these other amazing accounts can’t be true despite the sheer number of witnesses, no matter how credible and sincere they seem to be.
What if
the witnesses’ story happened now instead of 200 years ago?
We wonder how many of us would actually believe the Book of
Mormon witnesses if they lived today instead of the 19th
century. Would you honestly believe a
group of people that all told the story of some fantastic event if they lived
when you did? Frankly it’s easy to
believe strange things as long as they happened a long time ago – the further
back, the stranger i.e. Noah’s
In contrast to what the BOM witnesses have stated, many members of the community that knew Joseph made the following sworn statements. Go to the following link:
http://zarahemlacitylimits.com/wiki/index.php/Mormonism_Unvailed%2C_chapter_17
Many of these affidavits are in direct
conflict with Joseph’s account of the beginnings of the
"As I was
passing, yesterday, across the woods, after a heavy shower of rain, I found, in
a hollow, some beautiful white sand, that had been washed up by the water. I
took off my frock, and tied up several quarts of it, and then went home. On my
entering the house, I found the family at the table eating dinner. They were
all anxious to know the contents of my frock. At that moment, I happened to
think of what I had heard about a history found in
To my surprise,
they were credulous enough to believe what I said. Accordingly I told them that
I had received a commandment to let no one see it, for, says I, no man can see
it with the naked eye and live. However, I offered to take out the book and
show it to them, but they refuse to see it, and left the room." Now, said
Jo, "I have got the damned fools fixed, and will carry out the fun."
Notwithstanding, he told me he had no such book, and believed there never was
any such book, yet, he told me that he actually went to Willard Chase, to get
him to make a chest, in which he might deposit his golden Bible. But, as Chase
would not do it, he made a box himself, of clap-boards, and put it into a
pillow case, and allowed people only to lift it, and feel of it through the
case.
Why should we believe all the Book of Mormon witnesses over the sworn affidavits of over dozens of unrelated townspeople?
Note: The LDS church must find Ingersoll’s affidavit somewhat credible as The Ensign magazine quoted from it, as well as Isaac Hale’s affidavit, as historical sources in an article about Joseph Smith’s early years.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.mormon/msg/98349bc70c2eb0ad
If someone was going to have witnesses to some earth-shattering event, and they wanted people to believe them, they would have done it very differently than Joseph did. The whole witnesses’ portion of the BOM would have been much better served if the following things had been done:
1)
None of the witnesses
should have been related to Joseph or each other. Most of the witnesses were either
related or good friends. Having unrelated
people as witnesses would be far more effective than using your brothers and
father.
2) The witnesses should not have already been eager believers. There should have been some skeptics.
3) There should have been no financial motive. Martin Harris mortgaged his farm and invested some $5,000 of his own money into printing the Book of Mormon, so of course he had incentive to ‘promote’ the book.
4)
Each of the witnesses
should each have written their own testimony instead of merely signing a
prepared statement written by Joseph. If
the prepared document wasn’t 100% accurate many people would simply sign it
anyway as it would be too much of a hassle to have it completely rewritten by hand
– especially in the 1800s.
5)
The witness should have been much more detailed
about this amazing event. What did the
angel look like? What exactly did he
say? How did he speak? There are almost no details provided which
can be analyzed and compared. If each witness
had simply written their own account and provided significant details then
their individual testimonies could corroborate each other.
6)
The witnesses should
have been interviewed independently immediately after going public. They should have been interviewed the same
way police do with witnesses to crimes or that investigators do with UFO
cases. Ask questions to see if their
stories match; How was the angel
dressed? How tall was he? How did he speak?, etc.
7)
The witnesses should not have used subjective
language and say strange things like comparing seeing the plates with seeing a
city through a mountain or using spiritual eyes instead of their natural eyes
to view physical plates.
8)
The witnesses should not have been gullible
people that believed in things like ‘second sight’, divining rods, finding
treasure by placing a rock in a hat, etc.
That the Three Witnesses were a gullible sort is illustrated by an
incident in July, 1837. Joseph had left
on a five-week missionary tour to
9)
All of the witness should have been much more
vocal and been interviewed much more often.
There are very few interviews done with the witnesses that provide any
additional information or corroboration of their statements. You would think that these people, after
seeing such a magnificent sight, would spend their time testifying to the world
about their experience instead of largely just signing a prepared statement and
avoiding interviews by the media.
10) And
of course it would have helped had all the witnesses remained loyal to the
Church for the rest of their lives instead of having some of them abandon it
later on. It doesn’t make much sense to
leave the true
The governor of Illinois, Thomas Ford, who was very aware of the Mormon movement in his state, had given his own opinion as to how Joseph Smith collected the testimony of the witnesses, having known several well known men of Smith's acquaintance:
.. the witnesses were "set to continual prayer and other spiritual exercises." Then at last "he assembled them in a room, and produced a box, which he said contained the precious treasure. The lid was opened; the witnesses peeped into it, but making no discovery, for the box was empty, they said, "Brother Joseph, we do not see the plates." The prophet answered them, 'O ye of little faith! how long will God bear with this wicked and perverse generation? Down on your knees, brethren, every one of you, and pray God for the forgiveness of your sins '.. The disciples dropped to their knees, and began to pray in the fervency of their spirit, supplicating God for more than two hours with fanatical earnestness; at the end of which time, looking again into the box, they were now persuaded that they saw the plates."
Through the sheer force of Smith's suggestions, coercive
threats and their own earnest desire to see what he said was there, yet
obscured by their "sinfulness", the eight men "saw" the
plates. This certainly is what Harris
meant by seeing "plates" with the "eyes of faith" that did
not exist. Cowdery's own admission that
he didn't see the plates at all during the translation work and his spasms of
wavering faith that they existed certainly aren't faith building for Mormons,
but they are disarmingly candid admissions. What all of these men actually did was to
help create a bogus set of testimonials to events and objects that never
existed, except in their minds.
Note: Some LDS apologists state that Governor Ford did not make this hypothesis or at least he wasn’t the first person to suggest this. Whether or not that is true, this hypothesis is a reasonable one and cannot be dismissed – regardless of who may have said it first.
No Man Knows My History by Fawn McKay Brodie
http://www.spiritwatch.org/mobehbom.htm
Testimony
of Abagail and Lucy Harris.
Here is some compelling testimony against Martin Harris, by two witnesses that knew him best:
Mrs. Abigail Harris: a
sister-in-law of Martin Harris
". . . . Martin Harris and Lucy
Harris, his wife, were at my house [early part of winter, 1828]. In
conversation with the Mormonites, she [Lucy Harris] observed that she wished
her husband would quit them, as she believed it all false and a delusion. To
which I heard Mr. Harris reply: ‘What if it is a lie; if you will let me alone
I will make money out of it!' I was both an eye- and ear-witness of what has
been above stated, which is now fresh in my memory, and I speak the truth and
lie not, God being my witness."
Lucy Harris: wife of Martin Harris
"Whether the Mormon religion be
true or false, I leave the world to judge; for its effects on Martin Harris
have been to make him more cross, turbulent and abusive to me. His whole object
was to make money out of it. I will give a proof of this. One day at Peter
Harris' house (Abigail Harris' husband) I told him he had better leave the
company of the Smiths, as their religion was false. To this he replied,
"If you would let me alone, I could make money out of it.' It is in vain
for the Mormons to deny these facts, as they are well known to most of his
former neighbors."
http://www.sidneyrigdon.com/dbroadhu/NY/miscNYC4.htm
http://www.carm.org/lds/unveiled2.htm
As an analogy, say that 11 witnesses claimed to have seen a murder.
Would that be enough evidence to have somebody executed?
To make this comparable to the Book of Mormon witnesses, let’s add some
details. There are two stores across the
street from each other, and the respective owners don’t get along too well. One of the owners claims that his rival
committed murder, and says that he can prove it because he captured the act on
his store’s video surveillance camera. Rather
than submitting the tape to the police, he invites over 11 of his good friends
and family members. He shows them the
tape, and then asks that they sign a joint statement that he had earlier
prepared. He then erases the tape.
No other evidence exists—there is no blood on the ground, no gunpowder residue
on the hand of the accused, and no murder weapon. In fact, there isn’t a body. There isn’t even any evidence that the alleged
victim even ever existed. All we have is
the statement written by the shop owner and signed by his friends that they saw
the video tape which then conveniently vanished.
Based solely on their joint statement, would you convict?
We’re trying to illustrate a couple of things here. First, the testimony of the eleven witnesses
has a contrived feeling to it. Usually,
Joseph went to great lengths to prevent anybody from seeing the plates. There aren’t any witnesses who were
independent observers, much less reports from the careful examination of
independent experts. We just have a
couple of carefully orchestrated and contrived events followed by jointly
signing previously-prepared statements.
Secondly, we’re trying to illustrate what Grissom said, “Normally, an
eyewitness is the least reliable evidence we have.” If there were literally no physical evidence
to support an eyewitness account of an event, and if the event in question is
fantastical in nature, then the reasonable thing to do would be to disregard
the witnesses.
Analytics
Joseph’s Persuasive
Abilities
Joseph was able to convince people to pay him to locate buried treasure
by looking at a rock placed in his hat. Of course he never found any treasure.
Joseph was able to convince Martin Harris that if he looked at the
golden plates, God would strike him dead.
Joseph was able to convince dozens of women that an angel with a sword
threatened his life if he did not marry them all.
Joseph was able to convince men, that bones they found in
Joseph was able to convince many people that Egyptians scrolls were
written by the hand of Abraham and that he could translate them.
Joseph was able to convince his followers that a pile of rocks they
stumbled upon in
Joseph was able to convince people that the bones buried in a mound in Kinderhook,
Even if all of that were true, Joseph had a remarkable talent to be
able to persuade people to believe what most people would consider totally
absurd.
The following summary of the witness’s lives was posted by 'justmythoughts' on Nov. 8, 2003 on the LDS critic’s website RFM:
THREE WITNESSES:
OLIVER COWDERY - Was born in Wells,
July 1938 - The Church's Elders' Journal stated "... on account of the
unfaithfulness of Oliver Cowdery ... and [his] opposition to our beloved
brother Joseph Smith, Jr ... [he has] been excluded from fellowship."
In 1841 the Mormons published a poem which stated "... Or Book of Mormon
not his word, because denied by Oliver...". Seasons and Times, Vol 2,
p482.
DAVID WHITMER - Was born in
"If you believe my testimony to the Book of Mormon; if you believe that
God spake to us three witnesses by his own voice, then I tell you that in June,
1838, God spake to me again by his own voice from the heavens, and told me to
'separate myself from among the Latter-day Saints'... [Address to all believers
in Christ, p27, 1887.]
MARTIN HARRIS – Was born in
The Mormons stated of Martin Harris, and a few other men within the pages of
the church's official newspaper at the time, "a lying deceptive spirit
attend them ... they are of their father, the devil ... The very countenance of
Harris will show to every spiritual-minded person who sees him, that the wrath
of God is upon him." [Latter-Day Saint's, Millennial Star, Vol 8
pp124-128.]
EIGHT WITNESSES:
CHRISTIAN WHITMER – born Jan 18, 1798
JACOB WHITMER - born Jan 27, 1800 Penn - Married Sept 29, 1825 - Baptized April
11, 1830 - 1838 - VOLUNTARILY LEFT THE CHURCH - Died April 21, 1856
PETER WHITMER, JR. – born Sept 27, 1809 Fayette, Seneca Co, NY - Married Oct
14, 1832 Vashti Higley - June 9, 1830 baptized & ordained elder - Oct 25,
1831 ordained high priest - Died Sept 22, 1836 – Died 7 years after his
testimony in the BOM ... BEFORE his other family members were Excommunicated.
JOHN WHITMER - Son of Peter Whitmer, Sr. and Mary (Musselman). Born August 27,
1802. Married Sarah Maria (
HIRAM PAGE - Born 1800
JOSEPH SMITH, SR. – [Father of JS] - Born 1771, Topsfield, Massachusetts -
Married Lucy Mack 1796; eleven children - Baptized April 6, 1830 - Mission to
St. Lawrence County, New York 1830 - Ordained to the High Priesthood 1831 -
Ordained Patriarch to the Church 1833 - Appointed Assistant Counselor to First
Presidency 1837 - Died 1840 of consumption, Nauvoo, Illinois.
HYRUM SMITH – [Brother to JS] - Born 1804
SAMUEL H. SMITH – [Brother to JS] - born March 13, 1808 - b. Tunbridge, Orange
Co, VT - Married Aug 13, 1834 Mary Bailey - June 9, 1830 ordained elder - June
3, 1831 ordained high priest - 1834-38 member of Kirtland High Council - March
1838 moved to Far West - January 1841 called to Presiding Bishopric of church -
Died July 30, 1844.
Responses to these issues by faithful
Latter-day Saints.
Faithful LDS Member response.
There are many statements saying the witnesses really saw and handled the plates with their own eyes and hands. Why should I discount these statements because some other visionary statements may have also been made by the witnesses?
Critic’s response.
If the plates were real then why would the following phrases
also be used when the witnesses described seeing the plates; ‘While praying I
passed into a state of entrancement, and in that state I saw the angel and the
plates’, ‘I never saw the gold plates, only in a visionary or entranced state’,
‘he only saw the plates with a spiritual eye’, ‘a visionary experience’,
‘seeing with the eyes of understanding’, ‘as shown in the vision’, ‘ never saw
the plates with his natural eyes but only in vision or imagination’, ‘I did not
see them uncovered, but I handled them and hefted them while wrapped in a tow
frock’, ‘they were shown to me by a supernatural power’, 'No, I saw them with a
spiritual eye', "I did not see them as I do that pencil case, yet I saw
them with the eyes of faith; I saw them just as distinctly as I see anything
around me - though at the time, they were covered with a cloth", ‘he never
saw them only as he saw a city through a mountain’, etc.
In the times Joseph lived people believed in magic. Having visions was not that uncommon. Joseph’s family also believed in magic and the power of seer stones. Oliver Cowdery used a divining rod. People believed in something called ‘second sight’ where people would see things as a vision in their mind. Joseph and his peers believed in it so strongly that they would actually go and try to dig up treasure that they saw in their minds – always to no avail.
To these people that believed in ‘second sight’, saying they saw something with their natural eyes or in this ‘second sight’ made no difference to them. To them it was real either way so they would often for simplicity sake say they saw something and leave it at that, which gives the impression that they saw something with their natural eyes as they would see anything else, yet they may have only saw it as a ‘second sight’ experience.
On the either hand, if they simply saw the plates just like everyone sees any tangible object then why on earth would they say any of these strange statements indicating it was not a normal experience like ‘I never saw them only as I see a city through a mountain?’ Have you ever tried to look at